00:00:00] Annette Delabarbara: For me, I think my biggest struggle was not really ever knowing what my truth was. Like, am I feeling this because it's true or am I feeling this because. I'm afraid of something and I'm running away. You know what I mean? Like it was very interesting to just to to be in my mind because it was constantly just like confused and fuzzy

[00:00:19] Thais Gibson: Hello and welcome to the Personal Development School podcast. I am so excited you're here. I am your co-host. Thais Gibson, along with our new special host, Mike DiZio. This is a podcast that discusses everything related to integrated attachment theory, the new attachment theory, along with the subconscious mind, relationships, communication needs, boundaries, and so much more.

[00:00:43] Thais Gibson: Throughout this podcast, you'll see a series of episodes I upload with new information. Educational tips all about how to thrive in relationships and really master your emotional state in your life, along with special guests hosted by Mike DiZio to discuss all of these amazing topics in some longer form content.

[00:01:01] Thais Gibson: Thank you so much for being here, and I really hope you enjoy this episode.

[00:01:10] Mike DiZio: Hello everybody and welcome to today's podcast. I'm so happy you're joining us whether you're listening or watching us on YouTube, thank you so much for being here and it's my honor to host this episode for you. So today we have someone on who I'd like to tell you a little bit about I introduce her.

[00:01:26] Mike DiZio: So she's an integrated attachment theory coach and has been a student at the Personal Development School for over three years. And her background is a diverse background. She has degrees in business and occupational therapy, is also a certified yoga instructor. She's been teaching in the Vinyasa style of yoga for the past 10 years and loves to incorporate breath work and somatic processing in both her coaching and yoga practices.

[00:01:52] Mike DiZio: She's always been interested in psychology and understanding the why's behind people's behaviors and is excited to share this understanding with others. Her goal is to help clients recognize and address the roots of repetitive, unhealthy patterns of behavior so they can put an end to them once and for all, and finally find freedom and happiness in their lives.

[00:02:14] Mike DiZio: Everyone. This is Annette De Barbara. Annette, thanks for joining us. How you doing today? 

[00:02:19] Annette Delabarbara: I'm doing great. Thanks so much, Mike, for the nice intro. I appreciate it and I'm happy to be here today. 

[00:02:24] Mike DiZio: Awesome. Great to have you. Okay, so we'll start you know, with people who don't know your background, do you wanna just give us a brief little synopsis of your background and sort of what led you up until now?

[00:02:36] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah, so I'm originally from the east coast of the, the US in New York. And so I got my undergraduate degree there in business. Concentrating in marketing cuz I was. Like you said, I was always kind of interested in psychology. And so marketing was it was a way to appease the pressures of family saying I should go into business, but keeping that like psych piece of it for me.

[00:02:57] Annette Delabarbara: And then I ended up moving out to Minnesota, which is where I'm at right now. And I came out here for my grad degree. got my master's in occupational therapy. And it's funny cuz now that I'm doing the coaching, there's a lot of overlap there. It's kind of working with clients to achieve their goals in different ways.

[00:03:11] Annette Delabarbara: So I'm definitely like incorporating the coaching into that piece as well. And then, like you said, I got my yoga teaching certification in 2013 so I've been teaching yoga and kind of incorporating that into my, my practice as well. That 

[00:03:24] Mike DiZio: was excellent. Thanks for sharing. So I just wanna know about your sort of journey.

[00:03:28] Mike DiZio: We're interested in hearing about your personal development journey and what you've been through. For yourself personally, was there like a catalyst, a rock bottom, an aha moment or a situation that sort of like propelled you into diving into your own personal development 

[00:03:42] Annette Delabarbara: journey? Yeah, so I've always been kind of interested in.

[00:03:46] Annette Delabarbara: The meaning of life and all that kind of stuff and, and what my sort of purpose is. And, trying to find just like a deeper sense of, of meaning and understanding. I've always had that interest in personal growth. And honestly, I've, you know, in my twenties especially, I would say like early twenties, I, you know, I battled with like depression and stuff like that and, and was trying to seek resolution for some of these struggles that I was facing.

[00:04:09] Annette Delabarbara: so I first kind of went the route of looking into like spirituality and kind of diving into that, mindfulness, meditation, things like that. And then I had a friend, cuz you kind of asked about a catalyst and I remember I had a friend who gave me the book the Power of Now By, by Acar Tole or Acar to, I can never mm-hmm remember how to pronounce his last name.

[00:04:28] Annette Delabarbara: But. He gave me this book and I actually could not get gr at the time because it was it was just like a very dense, kind of heavy not even heavy, but just too deep for me at that time. Like, my mind wasn't there yet. And I later read his book A New Earth, and that was really transformational for me.

[00:04:47] Annette Delabarbara: It just really went along with this idea of like, mindfulness and how, You are not your thoughts or you know, your conditioning, these like patterns that you've sort of been conditioned to believe. And that really was a huge catalyst for me because it made me realize, oh, there, there, there's something here.

[00:05:00] Annette Delabarbara: Like there's something to this. Whereas before I think I just was like, oh, I'm just gonna be stuck like this forever. That was a big moment for me. and then of course finding p d s that was another Moment where I kind of realized like, okay, there's hope and I can, I can transform out of these patterns that I was living.

[00:05:17] Mike DiZio: that's really great. Yeah. Cart toll or toley as well. I'm not a hundred percent sure. I, I've heard tole, I've heard both, he, he's really great. And actually in my own healing and sort of personal development journey as well, that was one of the first people that I really got into.

[00:05:32] Mike DiZio: And you mentioned like deep, you wanting to dig more into like deep spiritual topics and meaning of life topics. I absolutely love that kind of stuff and I never really had like people to talk to about that. So it's really great. Like, you know, you're into that and I'm sure a lot of people in the personal development school kind of like to dig into those topics as well.

[00:05:51] Mike DiZio: But, mm-hmm. That's really nice to see. Yeah. Okay, so. How did you hear about the personal development school? We mentioned that you've been in the school for about three years now. Like how did you first hear about it and what sort of prompted you to join? 

[00:06:06] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah, so like many others in p D s I was prompted to join because of a failed relationship.

[00:06:12] Annette Delabarbara: And I remember there was a specific situation. It was, you know, with an ex of mine and There was a period of time where we were after we had broken up and we were kind of friendly, we were maybe trying to reconcile and trying to just sort of see how things were going. And so we were spending time together and I just remember like this scene in my mind that still stands out to me where he was going to, to leave, like walk out the dorm and You know, we, we hadn't fought, it wasn't anything, you know, there wasn't anything going on in that moment other than like, okay, time for him to go.

[00:06:41] Annette Delabarbara: And I just remember feeling like a sense of like panic and it was like really strange. I'm like, what's going on? And it wasn't that, honestly, it's not the first time that that had happened with him and with oth another partner as well. So I started going into Google and being like, fear of abandonment, right?

[00:06:56] Annette Delabarbara: Because I, I knew a little bit about. attachment styles, not very much, but I was like, okay, I think this is like an abandonment thing. And anyways, Google, Google, Google. And then I got to YouTube basically on P D S channel. And so that's how I found it. I saw one of Thais' videos where she was specifically talking about my attachment style and just was like right on with it.

[00:07:18] Annette Delabarbara: And I'm like, oh my gosh. Sold me right there. so that was pretty much it. I mean, she gave me hope that like, I see you, I understand, and there's like a solution. There's hope. So I joined like right away. I kind of just got to a point where I thought like, I can't keep repeating these patterns.

[00:07:31] Annette Delabarbara: You know, they kept showing up in every relationship. So that was. How I found p ds and, and joined immediately. 

[00:07:38] Mike DiZio: Yeah, for sure. No, it's our patterns that we're like, what? What's going on here? Why does this always keep happening? Mm-hmm. And when we don't have answers, it's, it's frustrating. Mm-hmm. And I imagine in your situation when your partner would leave, like that would be very scary for you because you're literally having like a body visceral reaction.

[00:07:56] Mike DiZio: But your conscious mind is saying like, there's, there's no danger here. Like he's mm-hmm. Just leaving for, for the night or the day. So Wow. That's, that's really interesting. Yeah. And then on the other end, on the other end of it too, like mm-hmm. Imagine on the partner side of it, like, you know, we wanna make sure our partner's happy and not feeling upset, but like, if you are afraid that if you leave, they're gonna be feeling terrible.

[00:08:19] Mike DiZio: That puts a lot of pressure on the other end of the relationship as well. Yeah. So that's a great point. Yeah, for sure. So, no, I, I'm glad that you found some relief within the school there. Yeah. And if anybody else has gone through that and can resonate with what Annette's saying there are tools in the school to sort of deal with the, the body reactions that occur when things like this happen.

[00:08:41] Mike DiZio: Yeah. Excellent. So obviously you've studied a lot of attachment theory with your integrated attachment theory training and in the school, I'm just curious, like, did you hear about attachment theory or were you aware of it before personal development school, or did you hear 

[00:08:56] Annette Delabarbara: about it long before?

[00:08:59] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah, so I had heard about it from like I said, I was always interested in psychology, and so even in my undergrad I was taking like psychology classes as my, you know, like my elective classes. and also when I got my, or when I was applying to programs for my occupational therapy degree.

[00:09:15] Annette Delabarbara: I also had to take a few psych classes as like prerequisite classes. So like, before you could even apply, you have to sort of reach a certain foundation. So there I took developmental psychology and that's really, I guess, the most recent time that I remember hearing about it. But it was, and that was what, that was, you know, 10 years ago almost.

[00:09:33] Annette Delabarbara: and it was very general. It was very much like, you know, traditional attachment theory. you know, just the, the typical stuff that, you know, if you, even if you go on YouTube and you kind of look up the, you know, John Boby and like the original experiment strange situation, I think it's called.

[00:09:44] Annette Delabarbara: Like there's just sort of that traditional understanding of attachment theory. And I knew very generally, about the detachment styles, but I think the thing about PDs that's so awesome and, and really stands out for me anyway is like The way that in integrated attachment theory, you layer on traditional attachment theory and then all these other patterns, like the core wounds that tend to show up for each of them, their relationship to like different, you know, their emotional patterns, their relationship to boundaries but all these other like interesting things that like when you look closer, it's like, wow, there's actually these pretty clear themes, cross attachment styles.

[00:10:16] Annette Delabarbara: And those things aren't captured in traditional attachment theory. So I know I'm kind of like going down a rabbit hole answering your question. Mm-hmm. But I did know about attachment theory technically, but definitely not to like the depth that, that I've learned in the school. So, 

[00:10:29] Mike DiZio: Yeah, that's great.

[00:10:31] Mike DiZio: And I know kind of Thais breaks it down with her, like daily breakthrough videos on YouTube and whatnot. Mm-hmm. And sort of gives a lot of examples and stories that people can resonate with. to the point where I know sometimes I read in the comments, people are like, are you watching me, Thais?

[00:10:44] Mike DiZio: Are you, are you spying on me? Like, how do you know this about? Yeah. Mm-hmm. So it's, that's for sure. Excellent. So what would you say has sort of been one of your biggest areas of like personal growth since being in the school and going on your own journey? 

[00:11:00] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah, so I would say that I have worked a lot on like the relationship to myself.

[00:11:06] Annette Delabarbara: And I know that kind of sounds, it might sound like a little cliche, but I really came to realize that I had to take care of myself and, and love myself if I was ever going to have a healthy relationship. And in the school that, you know, you really get like concrete ways to do that.

[00:11:22] Annette Delabarbara: Like concrete ways to, you know, quote unquote show self-love. Because I remember, you know, before I got into the school, I was like, what did that even mean? Like, I was like, how do I love myself? Like, I love myself, all right. But like actually showing that through actions. And I'll share like a quick story, you know, for me one thing that I noticed was that like, I would kind of like deprive myself of, of silly things, you know, so this sticks out in my mind as an example.

[00:11:46] Annette Delabarbara: I remember. there were times where I would go to like, choose my clothes for the day. And like, this is, especially during Covid, right? Like I was working from home. I was fortunate enough to, you know, to, to work from home. And there were some days where I'd wanna change it up from like, the sweatpants, you know, and and be like, oh, like I have this nice shirt that I wanna wear, or something like that.

[00:12:04] Annette Delabarbara: And I just remember thinking like, oh no, I'm not gonna wear that, it's not a special occasion, you know, I'm not, I'm not gonna see anyone today, so why am I gonna wear a nice shirt? And it sounds like not much, but when you really think about it, it's like, what was happening there was that, in my mind I was thinking, oh no, you're, you're not worthy of wearing this shirt unless you're gonna go wear it in front of someone and get acknowledged for it.

[00:12:24] Annette Delabarbara: Right. I was able to like, start catching myself in that pattern of, just not treating myself and not allowing myself to like, Basically have things that like I, I wanted to have. And so I started like, you know, wearing the nice shirts and it might not seem like much, but that was part of this like self-love process for me.

[00:12:40] Annette Delabarbara: And this like internal work was stuff like that. And, and you know, checking in with myself throughout the day. just, just giving myself the love that like I was hoping other people would give to me was, was really big. For me personally, so, yeah, 

[00:12:52] Mike DiZio: no, for sure. That rings so true.

[00:12:54] Mike DiZio: Mm-hmm. And you know, with self-love, people are gonna be like, okay, what do I do there? Like, look myself in the mirror and say, I love you, I love you, I love you. Like you can do that. But you said it right there, it's the actions sort of behind it. Mm-hmm. as you know, you would want to show somebody in your life that you love, how would you show them?

[00:13:10] Mike DiZio: You would show them by doing things. You would show them by like showing up daily. Cuz anybody can kind of, kind of say things like, I love you, but if there's nothing sort of showing that, so literally we have to do that to ourself. And I love the analogy you gave of, of how you showed yourself self-love and mm-hmm.

[00:13:27] Mike DiZio: You know, choosing assured in an outfit that made you, made you feel good. Yeah. And just for, for that reason alone. So definitely the action piece has to be behind it with self-love. Yeah. And it sounds like you've got that down pat. 

[00:13:41] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah, yeah. I'm trying. Yeah. I, the thing that I always keep in my mind is like, we tend to save things for like special occasions and we just have to remember that like we are the special occasion.

[00:13:50] Annette Delabarbara: Yes. You know, and we can, like, we can treat ourselves that way, so for sure. Yeah. Mm-hmm. 

[00:13:55] Mike DiZio: That's why I don't love Valentine's Day. I'm like, you, you know, we should be celebrating our partner all the time, not just waiting for one day. Mm-hmm. That's so true. Yeah. Yeah. That's funny. Then your partner gets mad saying, why don't you get me anything on Valentine's Day or mad when I give them something the next day and it has like the 50% off sticker on it.

[00:14:14] Mike DiZio: Yep. Okay. So thank you for sharing. So I wanna ask now, sort of. Now that you've done a lot of work on healing your attachment style, how have your relationships changed? Specifically? So you touched on the sort of relationship to self mm-hmm. But relationships outside of you, whether it be friendships, family, romantic relationships.

[00:14:36] Mike DiZio: Have you seen a change in that area? 

[00:14:38] Annette Delabarbara: Mm-hmm. Yeah, definitely. And so I was originally in FA as well. I don't think I mentioned that. So I was originally fearful, avoidant, and so I'm very like volatile. I coined the term that I was a flaming, fearful, avoidant just because I just was very volatile, angry.

[00:14:52] Annette Delabarbara: I didn't know how to deal with conflict. And I didn't really honestly know how to deal with my emotional experience because I Would feel a lot and then just like not know what to do with it. So my relationships with others have definitely improved because I've learned this skills to actually first of all figure out, okay, what am I feeling and why?

[00:15:09] Annette Delabarbara: And like, where is it coming from? Which I like really had a lot of trouble with in the past. then like going and communicating it in like a healthy way rather than like in an angry outburst because I was like holding it in for two months, you know? So that's been huge. Like just being able to like communicate.

[00:15:25] Annette Delabarbara: The, the biggest example of this in my mind is my relationship with my mom. You know, we're very close, but we, we've always kind of had like this up and down relationship. and I think it's a lot of that was like my volatility her own stuff from, her life experiences, which now I can sort of look at and understand a little bit better, rather than being so reactive to.

[00:15:43] Annette Delabarbara: But yeah, like with her, I've been able to just communicate things like, those three things have been huge. So being able to see her experience right and like, kind of validate and understand like where she's coming from, even if it's not, she's not showing it in the best behavior or the healthiest, behavior.

[00:15:59] Annette Delabarbara: Just being able to see where she's coming from. Then being able to check in with like myself, what's going on for me. What are my stories? What am I needing? And then third, going to like actually communicate it. I mean, those things have been huge with her. And really all my relationships, but that's really the one where I've seen the most change.

[00:16:14] Annette Delabarbara: and what's cool is also seeing her respond to that a little bit. Like it's very new. I think it's a very new way of, of being and communicating like, This emotional literacy, I don't think is really taught to people all the time. And so I do think it's a little bit new to her.

[00:16:31] Annette Delabarbara: And so seeing her kind of pick up on things like, I have to lead the way, but you can tell that she's like, starting to put little bits of effort in and like understanding and communicating and stuff like that. So it's been a really rewarding process. for my own growth, but then seeing her kind of come along with it as well.

[00:16:48] Annette Delabarbara: So yeah, that's a huge 

[00:16:50] Mike DiZio: impact. Mm-hmm. That's amazing. Like you showed up for yourself, you learned tools and tips to improve your own life, but now you're affecting your mom as well. Mm-hmm. And if you can imagine, you know, from our parents' generation, The amount of availability of like learning how to set boundaries, learning how to communicate.

[00:17:08] Mike DiZio: Yeah. Like there just wasn't that information out there. Like there was no internet. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. But even I remember a time like not too, too long ago where like the personal development section of like a bookstore. Was a very small section, like you'd be lucky to get like, you know, two rows on a shelf.

[00:17:25] Mike DiZio: Now personal development section is like rows and rows. Mm-hmm. So we're really fortunate now to have all this information and it's so cool to be showing our parents yeah, some things that can really help them. So I'm super happy to hear that yeah, a great share. Thank you. I was just gonna say, you make such an interesting point, and this is definitely like a rabbit hole for another podcast episode, but like the idea of how internet, like has, has made emotional literacy, like more available to people too, I think is like a, such a great point that I really never thought of before.

[00:17:57] Annette Delabarbara: The idea that I could Google and find PDS and Thais is kind of amazing. So we are definitely grateful for that. 

[00:18:04] Mike DiZio: Yeah, for sure, for sure. Then maybe there's an abundance, like too much choice. You're like, where do I start? Yeah for sure. But no, it's definitely I think a very positive thing and it's cool.

[00:18:14] Mike DiZio: It's at our fingertips. Mm-hmm. Just to backtrack, you shared you were fearful, avoidant when you came into the school. What was, what would you say is just overall the hardest thing that was. Being fearful, avoidant, what was like some daily things that were like really hard to deal with. Mm-hmm. 

[00:18:30] Annette Delabarbara: Fearful avoidant attachment style is interesting because you definitely have like the worst of both worlds in a way. I think for me It was a lot of like confusion because, so, and for anyone who's listening and maybe isn't super familiar with fruitful avoidant, you're basically kind of swaying between like this anxious side, you know, the anxious, preoccupied end of the gamut.

[00:18:52] Annette Delabarbara: And then like the dismissive avoidant end, which is the more avoidant side. So you have elements of both and you often you end up like kind of swinging between the two. And so for me, I think my biggest struggle was the nearly constant confusion that existed for me. Like not really ever knowing what my truth was.

[00:19:14] Annette Delabarbara: Like what am I feeling and is this, am I feeling this because it's true or am I feeling this because I'm afraid of something and I'm running away? You know what I mean? Like, it was a very interesting It was very interesting to just, to to be in my mind because it was constantly just like confused and fuzzy.

[00:19:32] Annette Delabarbara: so that was, I think, I would say the biggest thing. other than that, I mean, kind of goes along with that, but feeling just not really feeling super fulfilled because again, I, I never really knew, I guess. Yeah, it does go hand in hand. Like I never knew what my truth was, so I couldn't even make decisions on like career or relationships, obviously, things like that.

[00:19:50] Annette Delabarbara: And so that ended up just giving me a, a very general sense of like, blah is the best way I can put it. Like, I felt like I had a cloud over my heart in a way. And I just kind of felt like, oh, this is, the way life is. It's not, meant to be. Like a happy place. I, that sounds so depressing, but that's how I felt, you know?

[00:20:10] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah. It was just like a lot of confusion and just a lot of I guess like melancholy is a good word for it. Or malaise. I don't know. Maybe not malaise, but yeah, just generally not, not feeling super fulfilled in life and not really understanding like what I was feeling or going 

[00:20:25] Mike DiZio: through. Yeah, that sounds very difficult.

[00:20:27] Mike DiZio: You know, if one day you're feeling this way, the next way, the opposite. Mm-hmm. Building that self-trust and knowing like, okay, I know I want this, this is what I'm gonna go for. Mm-hmm. And you think that one day, but then the other day you're thinking something totally different. No, I can't do this.

[00:20:41] Mike DiZio: Mm-hmm. Or. I, I'm not good enough for this. Mm-hmm. But it sounds very confusing and can be pretty scary, I'm sure. 

[00:20:49] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah, and I also, I put my partners through a lot for sure. Cuz I think they kind of just came along for the ride sometimes and, you know, I can imagine it's really hard Right. On a partner to, to kind of go through that too, so.

[00:21:00] Annette Delabarbara: Right. 

[00:21:00] Mike DiZio: Right. And we've all heard a sort of the fa explosion where, mm-hmm. The resentment tank builds, builds, builds. Mm-hmm. Everything seems fine and the partner doesn't know what's going on. And then one day just to, everything just comes out. They can't hold it in any longer. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, it can be a little challenging, but you know, as we know, there's reasons why those things happen and.

[00:21:21] Mike DiZio: Fas have some absolute amazing qualities to them. You know, superpowers you can even say. Mm-hmm. But definitely the one of my coworkers says fa, for sure is the hardest attachment style to be. She equates it to being In a minefield, So you're constantly getting triggered.

[00:21:38] Mike DiZio: You're just stepping on landmines all the time. And it's like, oh my gosh, when am I gonna just get a day where I feel like totally peaceful. 

[00:21:45] Annette Delabarbara: Yes. Yes. That's a great analogy. 

[00:21:47] Mike DiZio: I love that. Mm-hmm. Yeah. But we'll touch on later how there is peace on the other side. Mm-hmm. Yes, for sure. I'll, I'll ask you about that later.

[00:21:56] Mike DiZio: Okay. Amazing. so we like to know with people on our show kind of what they're doing with self-care and just rituals and things, they're doing on the daily. A lot of times we focus on sort of the big picture and, you know, we gotta heal this big monster of a, of an attachment theory of attachment trauma.

[00:22:15] Mike DiZio: But it's really It's beneficial and interesting to know what people are doing on a micro level. So I'll start kind of we, we've heard all heard the term self-care, I wanna hear what does self-care look like for Annette? 

[00:22:27] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah, yeah, it's a great question. So wait, because I think, yeah, self-care can be thought of as, you know, like, Bubble baths and chocolates and, you know, those are great.

[00:22:37] Annette Delabarbara: I'm not gonna hate on chocolate for sure. But you know, I, I think it's more than that. Like even a little bit of what I said earlier about the way you behave towards yourself and some of that also really checking in with yourself throughout the day. I have found that's really useful because it just gets you into that practice of Valuing yourself.

[00:22:56] Annette Delabarbara: Right? And like, just like if, if you had a loved one who you were literally with all day every day. I mean, every once in a while you would like look at them and be like, how are you doing? Like, you know so learning to do that for yourself and just check in like, are, how am I doing? Like, how am I feeling right now?

[00:23:11] Annette Delabarbara: Am I hungry? know for me in the past, another thing was that I used to just work and sit at the computer and like just work with work and then, I would sort of take a step back and realize I was like starving or like had to go use the restroom or something like that, and I just hadn't like, checked in at all throughout, you know, this like whatever, four hour time span.

[00:23:30] Annette Delabarbara: So just practicing doing that. Like I, I actually have a, an alarm set on my phone, like to go off every couple of hours, which is like probably excessive, but It's just like a, at this point, it's just like, oh yeah, I see it. And then immediately I'm just like, okay, like quick check in and, you know, everything's okay.

[00:23:45] Annette Delabarbara: Like, let's keep going. So that's been a big part of that, like self-love and self-care as well for me. and just letting your, you know, allowing yourself the things that you love in life, whether it's wearing a nice shirt or taking a break, you know, to go for a walk or something like that. Just like treating yourself like, like you would an actual, you know, Loved one around you.

[00:24:06] Mike DiZio: So I love that. And like the checking in, like how that's so important. And I know that's something we are always teaching at the school and like I was just thinking of an analogy, like imagine you were at a restaurant and. The server just drops off your food and then that's it. And then you never see them.

[00:24:24] Mike DiZio: Mm-hmm. Again, and you're like, well, I don't have a fork. Like, actually the, the is wrong. Like, there's just all these things that are not right, and then you just end up having to be like, okay, I'm just gonna leave. Mm-hmm. Whereas like, you need to check in, you need to be that someone for yourself to check in is mm-hmm.

[00:24:41] Mike DiZio: How, how's everything going right now? Do we need anything? Are we hungry? Are we tired? Mm-hmm. Should I get up and stretch? Like there's just so many different things. Yeah. But yeah, if we're not checking in, like we're just completely externally focused. And imagine your insides is just like going all over the place and probably sending some alarm bells, but you're just like, Can't mm-hmm.

[00:25:05] Mike DiZio: Can't deal with this now I gotta, you know, continue working or whatever. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. if you don't pay attention to those things, you're, you're gonna burn out, you're gonna, yeah. You know, eventually there's consequences to, like, never check in with yourself. Mm-hmm. So, I love that idea, both the alarm that you set, that's a really, really, mm-hmm.

[00:25:20] Mike DiZio: Cool idea. Yeah. Awesome. And then as far as like rituals, like, is there any like daily rituals that, like you, you have to do every day to sort of keep yourself in a good place? 

[00:25:30] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah, I do meditate. I try to do it every morning. I'm not like, but I usually do it every morning. If I don't do it, it's usually because I'll do like yoga or something like that instead.

[00:25:41] Annette Delabarbara: So I, I try to do like, we'll say a mindfulness activity of some sort in the morning. And then in the evening before bed, I do like a breathing exercise. And I also write out Well, I have an app, so I, I type out, I guess I, I type out like my wins for the day. I do three wins and three grateful things.

[00:26:00] Annette Delabarbara: And that's actually, it's funny, like when I remember when I first started doing those, I was kind of like, yeah, right, whatever, like this isn't gonna do anything. But I actually have noticed when I do that, and since I've been doing that, I'll notice like during the day, so, Obviously before I'm going to sleep, I'll, I'll, I'll, I'll write out the list, but then like the next day, or like during the day, you know, during other days, during the week, I will notice throughout the day when I make a win or I'm grateful about something.

[00:26:29] Annette Delabarbara: I hope that makes sense. Like I do it at night as a practice. But then I think doing it over time has taught me to notice those things at other times of the day. So, yeah, 

[00:26:38] Mike DiZio: that sounds like a great practice and so valuable, like if you're not sort of acknowledging and seeing those wins and really like, you know, Giving yourself credit for like, doing these things, they can easily be forgotten.

[00:26:51] Mike DiZio: And then you just sort of get mm-hmm. Lost in the weeds of like your, your day of work being stressful or whatnot. So, you know, it's like the little kid getting a star for like a good performance. Like that feels good. And like you, you deserve to celebrate. Moments of growth. Yeah. And we need to sort of, you know, just keep on accumulating those.

[00:27:10] Mike DiZio: Yeah. Sort of too easy to focus on what didn't go right in the day, but we also, we have to definitely give some weight to things that we achieved and that practice you have there sounds like a way to do that. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Okay, so lastly what I wanna mention is a lot of people, you know, personal development work can be heavy and like, you know, serious and, you know gutter do our healing.

[00:27:33] Mike DiZio: I just kind of wanna know like, what do you do for fun? What do you do just to let your hair down and just completely enjoy yourself and, you know, keep you in the moment. 

[00:27:42] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah. So I love traveling. When, when Covid hit, well, I've always loved traveling, but then when Covid hit specifically, we couldn't travel.

[00:27:50] Annette Delabarbara: And so I got into doing road trips across like the us. So I have a bucket list item, really my only bucket list item that I wanna hit all the national parks in the us. And I think there's about 63 of them. And I think I've done, I've done about like 23 I wanna say. So I'm like a third of the way there, although there's a whole bunch that are like in Alaska and very remote.

[00:28:12] Annette Delabarbara: So we'll see if I ever get to those. But yeah, I just love traveling. If you're familiar with, you know, for listeners who are familiar with p d s and like knowing your needs and all that stuff, I really find that I pr I have a high need for like exploration and nature. And so going on these trips like really fills those buckets for me.

[00:28:30] Annette Delabarbara: I also have a high need for like security and stuff and, and certainty. So I tend to like plan them out really well. Then it gives me like that freedom when I go on that trip to really like, enjoy it and be in the moment. So that's, I, that's my number one. And also I do a lot of yoga. I like baking.

[00:28:46] Annette Delabarbara: That also kind of meets my need for, for creative expression. Like I used to do cake decorating and stuff like that, so that was kind of cool. Yeah, so those are, those are like my big ones for sure. 

[00:28:57] Mike DiZio: Those are great. I love asking people about that. You can see them sort of light up when mm-hmm. You're talking about their favorite activities that mm-hmm.

[00:29:04] Mike DiZio: You know, make them feel good. So that's really interesting. Okay. So just a, a couple questions I was curious about you know, personal development school in the last three years. As we know there's a lot of tools exercises, certain things that we've learned in the personal development school.

[00:29:19] Mike DiZio: What tool would you say has been the most impactful for you in your time at p ds? 

[00:29:24] Annette Delabarbara: I would say the emotional processing tool for sure. It's, it's Kind of like a staple, like when people come into school, I know Thais always recommends taking like the emotional mastery course. And so that's a tool that's in there.

[00:29:37] Annette Delabarbara: And it's very much focused on like processing through your stories and figuring out what you really need out of the situation. It's like a step-by-step tool. So really like practical I found that that really worked super well for me in moments when I was triggered or really like ruminating about something.

[00:29:56] Annette Delabarbara: You know, just sitting down and like spending some time journaling through it was just like immensely helpful. in the moment you get like immediately and then repetition over time, like as you continue using that tool, it eventually becomes something that you just intuitively start to do. And it's, that's definitely been life changing for me.

[00:30:15] Mike DiZio: That's really great. And I know, yeah, when we're in a state rumination sometimes that can go on for so long and just be such a distraction and like take away from our joy in life. So that's really neat how there's a tool that can kind of help loosen that up and question our stories and add some help there.

[00:30:32] Mike DiZio: That's great. I also wanna ask you, so since you did the integrated attachment through your training, was there any tool within that that you're finding really effective or helpful in your coaching 

[00:30:43] Annette Delabarbara: practice? the emotional processing tool, of course, it's just like my, my go-to. But um, there's another tool, it's called B T E A just the B T E A acronym I guess.

[00:30:53] Annette Delabarbara: And it's just the idea that, B is for beliefs, B leads to T, which are our thoughts, thoughts lead to e emotions. And then e leads to a actions. And so it's this idea that like these things are all linked and it's cause and effect. So they're like, I like kind of doing it backwards with, with clients to kind of show them the connection.

[00:31:15] Annette Delabarbara: So if there's like an action that you do, right? So let's say, you know, you're, you blow up someone or, or maybe you get, you know, really clingy and try to like, attach to someone whatever it might be. If there's an action and it's not really serving you and you're consciously aware of that, we're able to like, backtrack.

[00:31:32] Annette Delabarbara: So like, from your a, your action, what's your e that you were feeling right before, what was your emotional state? What were you feeling before this action took place? And then what were your thoughts or your beliefs that Created that emotional response. So like as you were feeling those emotions, well, what thoughts were, were you thinking that was, that were, you know, creating these emotions?

[00:31:52] Annette Delabarbara: So it's like a really insightful tool, I think, for people who, you know, may not not be super familiar with the work. You know, just even just practicing, like for, you know, whoever's listening out there, like practicing in your daily life. Making that connection between your actions, your emotional state, and then your, your thought patterns and like what belief is potentially creating those thoughts.

[00:32:17] Annette Delabarbara: And so learning to see those connections I think will be huge. Even if you're not really starting to do the work quite yet or you're just dabbling into it. That awareness I find is really helpful for people. 

[00:32:27] Mike DiZio: Definitely. That's amazing just to see that there is a chain reaction. Mm-hmm. And then once you sort of put it out there and see all the different areas, then you can, you have a much better chance of changing the action.

[00:32:40] Mike DiZio: If we just consciously say like, okay, I don't wanna smoke anymore. I don't wanna drink when I'm stressed, like consciously. Okay. That would be great. But you have to look at sort of the underlying things that are causing you to mm-hmm. Do that reaction or, or that action. Yeah. So that's, that's really great.

[00:32:57] Mike DiZio: Okay, so do you wanna share, I usually ask a guests if they have sort of a tip a habit advice. Is there sort of anything you wanna leave with our audience in the form of something that can help people live a more fulfilling life? 

[00:33:11] Annette Delabarbara: yeah, I guess. That. Well, going back to like the B T E A, I would say developing that awareness for sure.

[00:33:17] Annette Delabarbara: Again, even if you're like not super clear on like how to even get started, just try to use that tool, like develop that awareness. And then also I would say for my fellow fas out there in particular Just take baby steps, don't feel super overwhelmed by the process because it, it can feel overwhelming.

[00:33:33] Annette Delabarbara: We do have kind of both sides, all the core wounds to deal with. And so just taking it little by little, right? The, the way that I like to think of it is, you know, think of yourself right now today, right? Whatever date it is that you're listening to this And thinking of yourself in exactly one year from now, or even like six months, honestly.

[00:33:51] Annette Delabarbara: That time is gonna pass, right? The six months, the year it's gonna pass. You can either choose to be in exactly the same spot that you are, or you can just take tiny baby steps, you know, do what you can do one core wound at a time, you know, and then in that six months in that year, You're gonna be you know, even if it's just a little bit more able to manage emotions, you're gonna be in an improved place, right? Even if you're just working baby steps at a time. So I kind of like to see the choices, you know, between do you wanna be in exactly the same space or even just like a little bit of a better space and moving in that direction.

[00:34:27] Annette Delabarbara: So you know, try not to get overwhelmed and just. Take it little by little and you're, you're gonna see that like over time things are just gonna things are just gonna get better basically. So, 

[00:34:37] Mike DiZio: yeah. Oh, I love that. And just to touch on, yeah. Fast forward for anybody who's starting their journey, thinks this is like huge.

[00:34:44] Mike DiZio: You touched on mm-hmm. Sort of a smaller picture and, you know, step by step What can they expect? Like how do you feel now we, we were saying before, you know, you were all over the map and Feeling depressed or maybe just all these different things. What are some of the changes now that maybe mm-hmm.

[00:34:59] Mike DiZio: People could look forward to if they really dive into healing their attachment 

[00:35:03] Annette Delabarbara: style? Mm-hmm. Yeah. So I would say the biggest difference is I mean, the biggest difference is really just a feeling of. stability is the best. And it's so funny cuz if I feel like if anyone out there is like hardcore fearful avoidant, like I was, they're not gonna believe me probably.

[00:35:18] Annette Delabarbara: But I promise you guys it's possible, right? Like I never used to think that, that there could be real stability in like genuine that's like contentment in life. where I'm at. It's just things are kind of peaceful. I still feel like, you know, happy and, and. Joyous emotions. And I still feel, you know, hurt sometimes when people do stuff, but it's just not this like total rollercoaster of emotion.

[00:35:41] Annette Delabarbara: if I get upset about something, I'm, I'm able to like work through it and not have like a huge emotional outburst. So it's just really been a lot, a lot of, a lot more stability. And yeah, I guess contentment really is like the best word for it. I love 

[00:35:56] Mike DiZio: that. Yeah. I know with fearful avoidance you know, growing up in a bit of a chaotic environment mm-hmm.

[00:36:01] Mike DiZio: There might have been chaos in the household. So then in our adult life, chaos is sort of the subconscious comfort zone. So chaos is the norm. It almost feels like. When there's no chaos, it's almost like, what's, what's going on here? When's, when's something bad gonna happen? Like, you know what I mean?

[00:36:18] Mike DiZio: Mm-hmm. So it's almost like you freak out when things are too calm. Yeah. But it sounds like you've gotten to an area now where you can have these periods of, of calmness and, and be like, okay, this is. What life should be like. We don't need these. Yeah. Extreme rollercoaster up and downs. Mm-hmm. 

[00:36:35] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah.

[00:36:35] Annette Delabarbara: That's excellent. Yeah, and it's funny you say that because that's actually something I had to work on too, was that when I got to a point where like, okay, I was working through core wounds, I was working through all this stuff, and things were feeling more stable, more peaceful. I actually, and this is common for fearful avoidance, you get to a point where, You're like feeling these things, but because like you said, it's not really part of your subconscious comfort zone yet, because you're so used to chaos, you actually have to do some work around why is it safe to be stable?

[00:37:04] Annette Delabarbara: Because you're, it's such an interesting thing, like you start feeling it, but then it almost like like a little discomfort that follows it because it's like not quite familiar. And so I have to do work around that too. Like being like, okay, this is actually safe. This is why these, this is a good thing.

[00:37:19] Annette Delabarbara: And because your brain just wants to go back to like, what is, let's go back to the chaos. So yeah, it's a great it's a great point as well. For sure. 

[00:37:27] Mike DiZio: Definitely. Okay, so we're getting towards the end of our podcast. This has been really amazing, Annette. Thanks for being here. just wanted to let our audience know like what services you're offering these days.

[00:37:38] Mike DiZio: We touched on the coaching, but please, you can go a little more into that. 

[00:37:42] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah, for sure. So so I do coaching. I'm also teaching yoga as well. I do, I teach one class a week right now online. And that's a donation based class. So, you know, I, I just keep that open to everyone. If you, you know, if you have the means to donate, that's completely fine if you're interested, just come on, come on in.

[00:38:01] Annette Delabarbara: And yeah, and then I do one-on-one coaching. Right now I'm working through p d s through the personal development school. So I'm available, you know, for one-on-one sessions through through the site. Yeah. Perfect. 

[00:38:12] Mike DiZio: That's great. And lastly, if someone wanted to contact you or maybe wanted to work with you, what is the best way to get in touch with 

[00:38:19] you?

[00:38:20] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah, so for coaching, you can go through uh, the personal development school website. And I don't know off the top of my head now, like. Exactly where you would go. By the time you're listening to this though, there should be a clear, Way to access like the one-on-one coaches. So that's one area.

[00:38:35] Annette Delabarbara: And then if you're interested in the yoga, you can check out my website as well. It's a little bit of a mouthful, so I guess we'll probably put it in the show notes hopefully. But okay. It's basically my first initial and my last name, a De Barbara dot Wix, w I. Dot com slash yogacoach. And I think I'm gonna eventually shorten that up and get a, another site for it.

[00:38:57] Annette Delabarbara: But for right now, that's where I'm just putting like my yoga and some of my coaching information as well. 

[00:39:02] Mike DiZio: That's awesome. Thank you so much. And yeah, folks, if you want to try personal development school on a seven day free trial, I'll put a link in the show notes. But yeah, if you're coming to the school, we have a great community.

[00:39:14] Mike DiZio: We have so many like weekly community events, live webinars, everything Annette's uh, fixture in our school. So if you join the school, you'll definitely see her at a lot of these things and uh, can kind of get to know her uh, even more. Um, But yeah, that's uh, that's it for today. Thank you so much, Annette, for being here.

[00:39:33] Mike DiZio: Really appreciate your time and uh, we'll check in with your journey, maybe uh, down the road and have you back on. But I just wanna say I really appreciate you being here today. 

[00:39:43] Annette Delabarbara: Yeah, thank you so much. I really appreciate the opportunity. And um, yeah, hopefully down the road we can kind of see where we're, we're both at.

[00:39:51] Annette Delabarbara: Great. Thank you so much, Mike. Okay. Take 

[00:39:54] Mike DiZio: care.